Problem Cars?

Well, as some of you know I have been trying out a 1971 AMC Javelin-AMX for the upcoming Tourney and it has been doing very well. In fact I was all set to race it in the Tourney but one thing was bothering me. For some reason I couldn't post times to the leaderboard. I would be racing clean fast laps that beat my previous times but it still wouldn't update. Other cars would do just fine but not the Javelin. This bothered me so much that I started to do some research. Here is what I found...

How does this title update address issues with leaderboard cars?



With this title update, we are temporarily removing the ability for certain cars to post times on the leaderboards while we investigate refinements to our Performance Index system that will allow us to once again admit these cars back in the mix. The affected cars:



1968 Dodge Dart HEMI Super Stock
1970 Dodge Coronet Super Bee
1965 Alfa Romeo Giulia Sprint GTA Stradale
1967 Dodge Coronet W023
1964 Ford Fairlane Thunderbolt
1971 AMC Javelin-AMX
1992 Lancia Delta Integrale EV0
1969 Chevrolet Camaro Z28


In addition to this temporary removal of these cars from posting leaderboard times, we will be wiping the leaderboard times of those cars across different leaderboards. In a future title update, we’ll be addressing the PI refinements in greater detail and once again allowing these cars to post leaderboard times. Stay tuned for more in the future.

So... Where does this leave us? I know some of us have used the 1965 Alfa Romeo Giulia Sprint GTA Stradale in previous Tourneys without incident (which is probably the car that OC was using when he had the same problem posting hot laps). Should these cars be banned from competition? At least until a patch is released? What do you guys think?

I think if it's a big enough problem that it's getting patched, then yes, they should be banned from the tourney.

S7 Epic wrote:I think if it's a big enough problem that it's getting patched, then yes, they should be banned from the tourney.

second

I kind of agree. That is why I brought it up. After I found out it was on a list of problematic cars, I couldn't in good conscious race it without bring up the issue. At the same time, I didn't see any problems with the Alfa GTA's in the last few Tourneys either. They didn't seem overpowered to me so I don't know. Still, probably best to ban them until they are patched and back on the leaderboards.

I told you so?

On a serious note why was the Spark not included for the lower classes?
I would think that we keep our same policy, anyone can use any car. Just keep in mind you'll get a lot of sh!t and people won't respect any wins you get as much if you use 'leaderboard' cars such as the spark, or apparently all those banned ones.

We also don't know how these cars are effected. The notice doesn't give any real details. I mean is the 1970 Dodge Coronet Super Bee super fast in every class? or for example is it just a problem with a B-Class build? or even a specific part that is unbalanced? Hard to say.

S7 Interseptor wrote:We also don't know how these cars are effected. The notice doesn't give any real details. I mean is the 1970 Dodge Coronet Super Bee super fast in every class? or for example is it just a problem with a B-Class build? or even a specific part that is unbalanced? Hard to say.

I think it's a problem that scales. The more you upgrade those cars, the more problematic they are.

I'm not keen on having the 'you'll just get sh1t for having one' ruling. I'll gladly take the sh1t if my car is easily 3-4 seconds a lap faster - as, I suspect would a lot of others when the field is so tight, right the way through.

S7 Epic wrote:

S7 Interseptor wrote:We also don't know how these cars are effected. The notice doesn't give any real details. I mean is the 1970 Dodge Coronet Super Bee super fast in every class? or for example is it just a problem with a B-Class build? or even a specific part that is unbalanced? Hard to say.

I think it's a problem that scales. The more you upgrade those cars, the more problematic they are.

I'm not keen on having the 'you'll just get sh1t for having one' ruling. I'll gladly take the sh1t if my car is easily 3-4 seconds a lap faster - as, I suspect would a lot of others when the field is so tight, right the way through.

I doubt it. I can barely handle the Javelin as it is and I have all the suspension stuff on there, including areo. I think it could devastate in C-Class but would be a complete mess as you moved up the power without being able to increase handling. Also, most of those are muscle cars so I don't think that many of them would be any good outside of the same type of range.

The super bee has been absolutely ridiculous for drag since the game came out. My guess is that they're looking at more than hotlap times. Is it balanced racing if a car can get so far ahead of everyone that they have no chance of passing unless they wreck the car out in corners?

I agree that if the devs feel the care have to be temporarily pulled from the leaderboards that we shouldn't use them in tourneys until there's a fix. However, I could never effectively control those cars on normal tracks so I'd only build one for drag tracks.

AtrumX wrote:On a serious note why was the Spark not included for the lower classes?.

This is what troubles me. We've seen from past leaderboards they're content with a particular car or two dominating, so to actually go back and take a look at certain cars...

S7 Epic wrote:

AtrumX wrote:On a serious note why was the Spark not included for the lower classes?.

This is what troubles me. We've seen from past leaderboards they're content with a particular car or two dominating, so to actually go back and take a look at certain cars...

Now the question you should ask is: Would the Spark be dominating the leaderboards if the the other cars actually were able to post times?

I have no opinion on banning cars, since I'm not likely to win a race unless there was a wreck, but it still comes down to driver skill to use said cars.

S7 Dovahkiin wrote:

S7 Epic wrote:

AtrumX wrote:On a serious note why was the Spark not included for the lower classes?.

This is what troubles me. We've seen from past leaderboards they're content with a particular car or two dominating, so to actually go back and take a look at certain cars...

Now the question you should ask is: Would the Spark be dominating the leaderboards if the the other cars actually were able to post times?

I have no opinion on banning cars, since I'm not likely to win a race unless there was a wreck, but it still comes down to driver skill to use said cars.

Probably not, and that is the point.

Well, I think it is safe to say that we should ban these cars for the time being, just to be safe. My Javelin was definitely fast. Not quite glitch fast, but faster than normal in my opinion. And since we don't know the extent of what these cars can and can't do, I think it's better to leave it alone entirely. So as of now I say we ban these cars. (until a patch can be applied and these cars are allowed on the leaderboard again)

On a related side note: I agree with Kenny. A lot of it has to do with driver skill. A less skilled player can take my Javelin and never post a time anywhere near some of my legit times. While I can take the same car and beat those same times easily. Yes, those cars might be faster than average, but a car can only help so much. You might drop a few seconds off you own best lap times but if those times are still 4 seconds off the lead then it didn't help you too much. It's not like getting in these cars makes you magically the fastest player out there. Then there is the shear number of ways to build and tune a car. Just because it is the same car doesn't mean your build is anywhere near as good but I digress...

It's not really a leaderboard car unless it has a leaderboard tune and leaderboard driver. Still, an unfair advantage is glitching and we will not use glitched cars in official competition.

The following cars will not be allowed in official competition until further notice:

1968 Dodge Dart HEMI Super Stock
1970 Dodge Coronet Super Bee
1965 Alfa Romeo Giulia Sprint GTA Stradale
1967 Dodge Coronet W023
1964 Ford Fairlane Thunderbolt
1971 AMC Javelin-AMX
1992 Lancia Delta Integrale EV0
1969 Chevrolet Camaro Z28

(P.S. Leaderboard cars are still allowed if you want to take sh1t for it LOL.)

That sounds like the best solution for everyone.